In this hobby, we tend to rack up a lot of checking and savings accounts, and it can be tedious trying to manage all of them. I wanted to provide a breakdown of the different transfer options available and the pros and cons of each. 1. ACH . This is a direct account to account transfer and is the most common type of transfer since all banks and CUs participate in the ACH network. There are two types of ACH - push and pull. a. ACH push is where you ask your FI to transfer money to another account from your account. b. ACH pull is where you ask your FI to transfer money from another account to your account. The reason there is a distinction here is mostly one of fees. Just about every FI offers ACH pull for free but many actually charge a fee for ACH push. ACH can take anywhere from a number of hours to a few days. This is up to the individual FI since ACH batches can be processed multiple times a day now which means the limitation is purely put in place by the FI. Currently same day ACH is limited to $1MM but most FIs put in much smaller daily/weekly/monthly limits here to protect themselves from fraud. Most of my banks and CUs charge for ACH push so between that and slower posting times than I would like, I only use this option when moving money to and from DCU. Some people open an account with an FI specifically to use to transfer money between accounts, called a hub account, but the banks and CUs don't really like this practice and some will shut your account down for it. 2. Zelle . Zelle is another option that is offered by FIs to facilitate moving money between accounts. It is specifically meant for personal transactions between two people who trust each other but it's not uncommon for people to use it to move money between their own accounts and doing so isn't against the ToS. Since Zelle is specifically designed for person to person transfers, the limits on this can be as low as $500 a day although each participating FI sets their own limits. Zelle is great if you need to send someone money because all Zelle transactions are typically free to the consumer (some shadier banks or CUs may charge a fee for this but it's not the way that the system is meant to be run and I can't think of any that do, just that the Zelle website does mention that they can) and they are usually immediate as long as the transaction isn't held up for fraud review (common on new accounts or people who haven't used Zelle recently) and as long as you're aware that you cannot normally dispute these transactions unless they are explicit fraud committed by someone else accessing your account. Basically, if someone rips you off, and you paid them with Zelle, that money is likely gone with no recourse. Just be mindful of that. I have used Zelle for years and it's my favorite way to move money. You do have to have a unique telephone number or email address for each account in the system which can be a bit of a pain but there are easy ways around this by creating a Gmail account because you can create aliases by adding a + sign or period in the email address. My favorite way is to add a + and a number. So like... take anonymous@gmail.com, for example. If you put in anonymous+1@gmail.com, you just made a new email address as far as most online systems (some won't take + signs, more on that in a sec) are concerned but Gmail will still deliver to the main "anonymous" inbox. If the + sign isn't acceptable by the system, add a period. a.nonymous@gmail.com will also go to the same inbox as will a.n.o.n.y.m.o.u.s and anonym.ous. Google's systems ignore periods in the address so you can put them between any letter(s) you wish. One final trick here, use @googlemail.com instead of gmail.com which will score you another address if periods and + don't work. You can also use Zelle with a bank or CU that doesn't participate in Zelle by downloading the Zelle app and using your debit card but this has to be tied to your mobile number, only supports one card at a time, and has a $500 weekly send limitation. Anyway, in all the time I have used Zelle, I have only had problems with Service CU flagging my transaction as fraud which was resolved with a quick phone call and Navy Federal changed my instant transfer to a delayed one that took a few days when I first started using it. Hasn't been a problem since. Every other time, the transaction has been instant with no issues. I actually pay my rent this way. 3. PayPal . This is another one of my least favorite ways to move money. It's similar to ACH but has a complicated fee structure. You also have to manually request PayPal move the money to the new account and then you're subject to ACH times too. Personally I wouldn't use this method unless someone sends you money on PayPal because they don't have any other way to do it. 4. Wire transfer . Wire transfers are not really used that much domestically these days outside of business transactions involving high dollar amounts because ACH can be just as fast and is much cheaper. Wire transfers are usually used when sending money abroad though since ACH is a domestic network. Fees with wire transfers are higher than most any other option. The one that I did when buying a laptop so I could get a cash discount was $30. As you can imagine, there is no purchase protection here either, make sure you trust the person you're wiring money to. 5. Western Union/Moneygram . These services are like wire transfers. They're expensive but they can be used to send and receive money both domestically and internationally without having deposit accounts. I have used both services before and would not do so again unless I had to. They are very commonly used for illegal transactions and it's not uncommon for them to flag transactions for further review and slow the whole process down, especially if you don't actually do the transaction in person. Avoid unless you have no other choice. 6. Check . You can always just write yourself a check from one bank account and deposit it into the other. I did this before Zelle became a big deal because writing the check was free and my bank charges a whopping $3 for ACH push. As long as you have an established relationship with the bank you deposit the check into, check processing times can be about as fast as ACH. When I used to write checks this way, I usually had access to the money the next day.
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[HOWTO] Moving money between checking and savings accounts

1 of 11
3 years ago
Sun Mar 13, 2022 8:24 pm
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Saeren
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In this hobby, we tend to rack up a lot of checking and savings accounts, and it can be tedious trying to manage all of them. I wanted to provide a breakdown of the different transfer options available and the pros and cons of each. 1. ACH. This is a direct account to account transfer and is the most common type of transfer since all banks and CUs participate in the ACH network. There are two types of ACH - push and pull. a. ACH push is where you ask your FI to transfer money to another account from your account. b. ACH pull is where you ask your FI to transfer money from another account to your account. The reason there is a distinction here is mostly one of fees. Just about every FI offers ACH pull for free but many actually charge a fee for ACH push. ACH can take anywhere from a number of hours to a few days. This is up to the individual FI since ACH batches can be processed multiple times a day now which means the limitation is purely put in place by the FI. Currently same day ACH is limited to $1MM but most FIs put in much smaller daily/weekly/monthly limits here to protect themselves from fraud. Most of my banks and CUs charge for ACH push so between that and slower posting times than I would like, I only use this option when moving money to and from DCU. Some people open an account with an FI specifically to use to transfer money between accounts, called a hub account, but the banks and CUs don't really like this practice and some will shut your account down for it. 2. Zelle. Zelle is another option that is offered by FIs to facilitate moving money between accounts. It is specifically meant for personal transactions between two people who trust each other but it's not uncommon for people to use it to move money between their own accounts and doing so isn't against the ToS. Since Zelle is specifically designed for person to person transfers, the limits on this can be as low as $500 a day although each participating FI sets their own limits. Zelle is great if you need to send someone money because all Zelle transactions are typically free to the consumer (some shadier banks or CUs may charge a fee for this but it's not the way that the system is meant to be run and I can't think of any that do, just that the Zelle website does mention that they can) and they are usually immediate as long as the transaction isn't held up for fraud review (common on new accounts or people who haven't used Zelle recently) and as long as you're aware that you cannot normally dispute these transactions unless they are explicit fraud committed by someone else accessing your account. Basically, if someone rips you off, and you paid them with Zelle, that money is likely gone with no recourse. Just be mindful of that. I have used Zelle for years and it's my favorite way to move money. You do have to have a unique telephone number or email address for each account in the system which can be a bit of a pain but there are easy ways around this by creating a Gmail account because you can create aliases by adding a + sign or period in the email address. My favorite way is to add a + and a number. So like... take anonymous@gmail.com, for example. If you put in anonymous+1@gmail.com, you just made a new email address as far as most online systems (some won't take + signs, more on that in a sec) are concerned but Gmail will still deliver to the main "anonymous" inbox. If the + sign isn't acceptable by the system, add a period. a.nonymous@gmail.com will also go to the same inbox as will a.n.o.n.y.m.o.u.s and anonym.ous. Google's systems ignore periods in the address so you can put them between any letter(s) you wish. One final trick here, use @googlemail.com instead of gmail.com which will score you another address if periods and + don't work. You can also use Zelle with a bank or CU that doesn't participate in Zelle by downloading the Zelle app and using your debit card but this has to be tied to your mobile number, only supports one card at a time, and has a $500 weekly send limitation. Anyway, in all the time I have used Zelle, I have only had problems with Service CU flagging my transaction as fraud which was resolved with a quick phone call and Navy Federal changed my instant transfer to a delayed one that took a few days when I first started using it. Hasn't been a problem since. Every other time, the transaction has been instant with no issues. I actually pay my rent this way. 3. PayPal. This is another one of my least favorite ways to move money. It's similar to ACH but has a complicated fee structure. You also have to manually request PayPal move the money to the new account and then you're subject to ACH times too. Personally I wouldn't use this method unless someone sends you money on PayPal because they don't have any other way to do it. 4. Wire transfer. Wire transfers are not really used that much domestically these days outside of business transactions involving high dollar amounts because ACH can be just as fast and is much cheaper. Wire transfers are usually used when sending money abroad though since ACH is a domestic network. Fees with wire transfers are higher than most any other option. The one that I did when buying a laptop so I could get a cash discount was $30. As you can imagine, there is no purchase protection here either, make sure you trust the person you're wiring money to. 5. Western Union/Moneygram. These services are like wire transfers. They're expensive but they can be used to send and receive money both domestically and internationally without having deposit accounts. I have used both services before and would not do so again unless I had to. They are very commonly used for illegal transactions and it's not uncommon for them to flag transactions for further review and slow the whole process down, especially if you don't actually do the transaction in person. Avoid unless you have no other choice. 6. Check. You can always just write yourself a check from one bank account and deposit it into the other. I did this before Zelle became a big deal because writing the check was free and my bank charges a whopping $3 for ACH push. As long as you have an established relationship with the bank you deposit the check into, check processing times can be about as fast as ACH. When I used to write checks this way, I usually had access to the money the next day.
Saeren
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Re: [HOWTO] Moving money between checking and savings accounts

2 of 11
3 years ago
Sun Mar 13, 2022 9:42 pm
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BrutalBodyShots
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Very nice write up @Saeren , well done!
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Re: [HOWTO] Moving money between checking and savings accounts

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3 years ago
Mon Mar 14, 2022 11:25 am
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Birdman
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Yes very well done thank you it will definitely be an asset to the knowledgebase. I would note that I think Zelle is recorded or associated with what’s the name of the fraud network by the big five banks or six or seven? @Saeren Also do all FIs offer push?
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Re: [HOWTO] Moving money between checking and savings accounts

4 of 11
3 years ago
Tue Mar 15, 2022 7:27 am
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Cassie
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Saeren wrote: Sun Mar 13, 2022 8:24 pm In this hobby, we tend to rack up a lot of checking and savings accounts, and it can be tedious trying to manage all of them. I wanted to provide a breakdown of the different transfer options available and the pros and cons of each.
Now this is content! Very nice, @Saeren ! I learned something. Exactly the sort of thing I need to flag for Google/Bing.
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Re: [HOWTO] Moving money between checking and savings accounts

5 of 11
3 years ago
Tue Mar 15, 2022 12:44 pm
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Saeren
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Glad that it was helpful. :)
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Re: [HOWTO] Moving money between checking and savings accounts

6 of 11
3 years ago
Tue Mar 15, 2022 12:52 pm
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Cassie
DeveloperLoves long talks on the beach
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Saeren wrote: Tue Mar 15, 2022 12:44 pm Glad that it was helpful. :)
I remember investigating ways to send money to someone in Nebraska, and that's when I got rid of PayPal. lol It was kind of an emergency too, so they could get groceries in the next day or two. I ended up putting $200 cash in an envelope inside a $3.85 (at the time) Priority 2-3 day USPS envelope. Did it again too. And again. Maybe a few more times. :oops: Always got there fine. Not that I go around recommending it or anything. lol
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Re: [HOWTO] Moving money between checking and savings accounts

7 of 11
3 years ago
Tue Mar 15, 2022 12:56 pm
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Saeren
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Cassie wrote: Tue Mar 15, 2022 12:52 pm
Saeren wrote: Tue Mar 15, 2022 12:44 pm Glad that it was helpful. :)
I remember investigating ways to send money to someone in Nebraska, and that's when I got rid of PayPal. lol It was kind of an emergency too, so they could get groceries in the next day or two. I ended up putting $200 cash in an envelope inside a $3.85 (at the time) Priority 2-3 day USPS envelope. Did it again too. And again. Maybe a few more times. :oops: Always got there fine. Not that I go around recommending it or anything. lol
We do what we have to do. Zelle would be my first choice in that situation but PayPal does have the instant debit card option that has a small fee which would be an option too. Unfortunately PayPal picks and chooses when they will front you the money or force you to wait for the ACH to clear so you would have to use a credit card. AMEX doesn't charge a fee if you use their app to send money through PayPal. https://www.americanexpress.com/us/serv ... and-split/ I have heard that Google Pay will let you send up to $10K to someone through their email address but I have never tried it so I didn't include it.
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Re: [HOWTO] Moving money between checking and savings accounts

8 of 11
3 years ago
Tue Mar 15, 2022 1:27 pm
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Justaguy
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Great summary, @Saeren! There’s one small thing you might want to clarify. Wire transfers might be uncommon for consumer transactions, but they are still very widely used in business deals. Wire is a very secure and relatively fast way to send large amounts of money. There can be fees of $25+, but those are trivial on transactions of millions or more.
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Re: [HOWTO] Moving money between checking and savings accounts

9 of 11
3 years ago
Tue Mar 15, 2022 1:36 pm
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Saeren
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Justaguy wrote: Tue Mar 15, 2022 1:27 pm Great summary, @Saeren! There’s one small thing you might want to clarify. Wire transfers might be uncommon for consumer transactions, but they are still very widely used in business deals. Wire is a very secure and relatively fast way to send large amounts of money. There can be fees of $25+, but those are trivial on transactions of millions or more.
What advantage does wire have over ACH though? ACH is incredibly secure too seeing how there is heavy government oversight so I question the value of wire transfers in the modern banking age. I did go ahead and edit the post to say that it's using in high dollar business transactions.
Saeren
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Re: [HOWTO] Moving money between checking and savings accounts

10 of 11
3 years ago
Tue Mar 15, 2022 2:24 pm
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Justaguy
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Saeren wrote: Tue Mar 15, 2022 1:36 pm
Justaguy wrote: Tue Mar 15, 2022 1:27 pm Great summary, @Saeren! There’s one small thing you might want to clarify. Wire transfers might be uncommon for consumer transactions, but they are still very widely used in business deals. Wire is a very secure and relatively fast way to send large amounts of money. There can be fees of $25+, but those are trivial on transactions of millions or more.
What advantage does wire have over ACH though? ACH is incredibly secure too seeing how there is heavy government oversight so I question the value of wire transfers in the modern banking age. I did go ahead and edit the post to say that it's using in high dollar business transactions.
Wire transfers are faster. There are no bank holding times at all. So if I’m buying something from you for millions of dollars, and the funds are going to an escrow first, it will be important to both of us that I can send the money in to escrow on the same day that they send it out to you. No one wants to pay even one extra day’s interest if they can avoid it. Also, ACH transfers are processed in batches, whereas wire transfers are one-off and on demand. Not worth the cost and hassle for small transactions, but with larger ones people often want that added level of control.
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Re: [HOWTO] Moving money between checking and savings accounts

11 of 11
3 years ago
Tue Mar 15, 2022 2:40 pm
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Saeren
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Justaguy wrote: Tue Mar 15, 2022 2:24 pm
Saeren wrote: Tue Mar 15, 2022 1:36 pm
Justaguy wrote: Tue Mar 15, 2022 1:27 pm Great summary, @Saeren! There’s one small thing you might want to clarify. Wire transfers might be uncommon for consumer transactions, but they are still very widely used in business deals. Wire is a very secure and relatively fast way to send large amounts of money. There can be fees of $25+, but those are trivial on transactions of millions or more.
What advantage does wire have over ACH though? ACH is incredibly secure too seeing how there is heavy government oversight so I question the value of wire transfers in the modern banking age. I did go ahead and edit the post to say that it's using in high dollar business transactions.
Wire transfers are faster. There are no bank holding times at all. So if I’m buying something from you for millions of dollars, and the funds are going to an escrow first, it will be important to both of us that I can send the money in to escrow on the same day that they send it out to you. No one wants to pay even one extra day’s interest if they can avoid it. Also, ACH transfers are processed in batches, whereas wire transfers are one-off and on demand. Not worth the cost and hassle for small transactions, but with larger ones people often want that added level of control.
Interesting. When I did one it took two days to process (although part of that was the bank verifying that the company wasn't trying to scam me) and cost me $30 to send $4500. I would have figured that same day ACH would be similar to a wire in terms of speed but obviously same day ACH does have the caveat that it's only up to $1MM.
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